From Alan Walker's Liszt biography: “Liszt sometimes practised for ten or twelve hours a day, and much of this labour was expended on endurance exercises-scales, arpeggios, trills, and repeated notes. He set great store by the absolute independence of each finger. Every scale was practised with the fingering of every other scale (using, say, C-major fingering for F-sharp major, and D-flat major fingering for C major). No pianist can afford to neglect Liszt’s fingering. It is both imaginative and original and often looks far into the future of the keyboard."
One of the reasons why he was so strong in sight reading. He could possibly adapt to everything because he wasnt restricted to a certain kind of fingering
Not just Ciffra does it. It's supposed to make the "galloping" feeling more noticeable, since it prevents legato. However, lots of pianists get the same sound with different fingerings. It's sad however, that so many editions of this piece don't have it printed in.
Liszt believed that each finger had its own specific tone it could get out of the piano. He wrote his fingerings not so you could play it easier, but so you could play it in the tone in which he intended. The middle finger was the power of the piano, but the ring finger was the soul. He believed the greatest thing he learned in life was a fully independent 4th finger
Well according to some sources the fingering is supposed to replicate the wild movement of a horse. Because the piece is based on Goethe mazzeppa a poem about a military official being ties to a horse that was then scared and starting running, killing the man.
I play with the original fingering! Totally worth it imo, and it can be brought up to comparable speed with the easier fingering. I really want to get a recording of it out there
It's 1am here, I am literally practising this piece right now at midnight at this pops up??? This fingering helps develops dexterity and also helps with other pieces like his paganini etude no 6 which also does the 24 fingering
When I first started playing this part, I used my own fingering, but then I started using Liszt’s fingering, and I like it a lot better because it gives it a galloping feeling.
Liszt's pupil Emil von Sauer's edition of Brahms's Op. 1 sonata prescribes the same fingering for the thirds in the finale. I avoided them for years as impracticable, but eventually discovered that, with the proper measure of flexibility or looseness in the wrist, this fingering is ultimately more conducive to extreme speed than any fingering scheme that changes fingers from one third to the next.
Данная аппликатура необходима для эффекта топота копыт лошади, как писали выше - ощущения скакания. Тем не менее, данный эффект пианисты получают и с сменой пальцев. Но как указал Лист, данная аппликатура полностью исключает легато.
haha I never saw the popular fingering for a while so I was using Liszts for an alarmingly long time. So glad I switched tho the piece is so much more enjoyable now
I play according to this version, and that's the only fingering I know of until I found another one the other day that attribute the first three to left hand and the second three right.
Fun fact: Some composers wrote with 3 lines of music; i believe i saw it in appassionata? don’t quote me - it could have been a completely different piece edit: also don’t hate on my saying “yea everyone knows that” cuz i guarantee you that a lot of people just learned this💀
dont slide, that ruins the point of a galloping sound, it should be detached and practically staccato also sliding doesnt work when youre going from a white key to a black key lol
Is it possible that his piano at the time would have had lighter keys? The earliest pianos were quite light indeed. Don't believe me? Try some of C. P. E. Bach's suggested scale fingerings--which were for _piano_ as it existed at the time, as well as harpsichord and clavichord. The general tendency is that what he suggests as a special case fingering for slow and legato is now the standard piano fingering.
Pianos of Liszt where indeed lighter, wich doesnt really solve the problem, I tried, bachs time pianos are not relevant here since thats way before Liszt time
@horoffra I play harpsichord, so my go-to approach to that sort of motion is to slide between the keys. I don't have a Steinway hasn't to try it on, but it works well enough on my electric piano.
Is it confirmed anywhere that Cziffra uses this fingering? I'm skeptical due to the speed he takes it. I find myself believing one can get the non-legato sound with other fingering, and that is much easier to do than getting 24 24 up to speed.
@@horoffra thanks. I tried 2424 for months and maybe got 80% of the speed…. So many pianists use the easier fingering. I always wondered if Cziffra used the easier fingering but just made it more staccato than most. To me it seems it would be easier to get the easier fingering staccato than the hard fingering at a fast tempo. If you find a vid of someone doing 24 24 at Cziffra’s tempo, I’d love to see it! It’s one of the hurdles I never mastered
@@ohartnet81 Well the staccato effect can not so easily be brought out with the conventional fingering but Liszt fingering allows it easily And for a technical giant like Cziffra I don't think its even that hard for him to get Liszt fingering up to speed.... so yes Cziffra did use Liszt's fingering , making him own this piece practically.
From Alan Walker's Liszt biography: “Liszt sometimes practised for ten or twelve hours a day, and much of this labour was expended on endurance exercises-scales, arpeggios, trills, and repeated notes. He set great store by the absolute independence of each finger. Every scale was practised with the fingering of every other scale (using, say, C-major fingering for F-sharp major, and D-flat major fingering for C major). No pianist can afford to neglect Liszt’s fingering. It is both imaginative and original and often looks far into the future of the keyboard."
You are right
Wow. He was amazing
That’s absolutely insane. Liszt was built different. Thanks for sharing!
ok this is a new year challenge!
One of the reasons why he was so strong in sight reading. He could possibly adapt to everything because he wasnt restricted to a certain kind of fingering
This is why this is an Etudes. And THAT is what Liszt wants you to practice. ;)
bro looked straight into my soul before playing the thing
And it sounds much better with Liszt's fingering. It sounds more powerful.
Not just Ciffra does it. It's supposed to make the "galloping" feeling more noticeable, since it prevents legato. However, lots of pianists get the same sound with different fingerings. It's sad however, that so many editions of this piece don't have it printed in.
that is actually such a cool effect!!
If listz writes it, then its the correct one
Agree
Right
Great job! Wonderful spiccato effect achieved by that fingering. Liszt knew what he was doing haha
Liszt didnt want other people can play the his music so He made so hard
Actually, the opposite is documented. He made his pieces easier, so that his works would be playable by others, rather than forgotten in history.
I thought i've downloaded the wrong sheet because of that fingering...
Hahaha 😆
@@Franz_Liszt_Korean 여기도 있네 ㄷ
@@marschdb ㅎㅎㅎ
Hahaha
isn’t it actually a good fingering though?
Liszt believed that each finger had its own specific tone it could get out of the piano. He wrote his fingerings not so you could play it easier, but so you could play it in the tone in which he intended. The middle finger was the power of the piano, but the ring finger was the soul. He believed the greatest thing he learned in life was a fully independent 4th finger
Arrau does the correct fingering. It's meant for musical purposes so not doing it goes against what Liszt wanted to achieve.
Well according to some sources the fingering is supposed to replicate the wild movement of a horse. Because the piece is based on Goethe mazzeppa a poem about a military official being ties to a horse that was then scared and starting running, killing the man.
*tied
@@davisatdavis1 What's the name of the piece please 🙏🏼
@@esthereagle mazeppa (it's in the title too)
Goethe never had Mazeppa bro.. Victor Hugo had...
That’s so cool. He’s using early fingerings from renaissance to early baroque!! So awesome.
Sounds good the way he plays it!
That’s actually a terrific fingering and gives you just the right effect! Lots of folks use it…
I play with the original fingering! Totally worth it imo, and it can be brought up to comparable speed with the easier fingering. I really want to get a recording of it out there
100% possible
Haha
I think he did it to imitate the horse front feet while running, considering the story behind Mazeppa
It's 1am here, I am literally practising this piece right now at midnight at this pops up??? This fingering helps develops dexterity and also helps with other pieces like his paganini etude no 6 which also does the 24 fingering
Thanks for playing it . Seems scarier on paper ..
It's sort of like playing thirds like octaves! Cool!
this is why i love lizst
It still makes sense tho
It makes perfect sense!
When I first started playing this part, I used my own fingering, but then I started using Liszt’s fingering, and I like it a lot better because it gives it a galloping feeling.
It's not harder this way, it's more of a natural gesture.
Liszt's pupil Emil von Sauer's edition of Brahms's Op. 1 sonata prescribes the same fingering for the thirds in the finale. I avoided them for years as impracticable, but eventually discovered that, with the proper measure of flexibility or looseness in the wrist, this fingering is ultimately more conducive to extreme speed than any fingering scheme that changes fingers from one third to the next.
Finger: can i try tha...
Brain: 😅
Looks like a cat playing tbh. Cute ❤
I think it makes more sense than doing a 42-31 fingering because with all those sharps and flats you’d probably get your finger stuck between keys.
Most importantly - after you played Liszt's fingering, did you learn anything new? I did!
Me too
same thing that I learned??? :)
@@horoffra
okay but at least it looks really cool
😊 smile
Данная аппликатура необходима для эффекта топота копыт лошади, как писали выше - ощущения скакания. Тем не менее, данный эффект пианисты получают и с сменой пальцев. Но как указал Лист, данная аппликатура полностью исключает легато.
i was waiting for smile at the end of video 😊
The dreaded triple staff
Bravo!! 👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽👏🏽
He encrypted his notes so no one can play them 😂 early version of music chriptography
it looks cool playing like that lol
I legit thought his hands swapped places and stayed that way
Yeah!! Activate those bouncy liszt hands, playing liszt is a different way of holding your hands
liszt hits hard😱
Yes he Does....
If Chopin Is a gentle rain while liszt Is the thunder that strikes the earth
@@miguelarturopalomaresruiz well said!!
@@miguelarturopalomaresruizwait till you hear Nocturne No.4 B section
@@miguelarturopalomaresruiz I like it, but Liszt did all of the elements
You're supposed to slide off of the first double into the next double, v doesn't seem that off to me
Can you play piano?
@@horoffra yes but never tried this behemoth
Hes watch be like wy are you running😅
Liszt from another world or he is God of piano
haha I never saw the popular fingering for a while so I was using Liszts for an alarmingly long time. So glad I switched tho the piece is so much more enjoyable now
👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼🎯♥️♥️♥️ Franz Liszt
Cool.🎶🎶🎶🎶
I play according to this version, and that's the only fingering I know of until I found another one the other day that attribute the first three to left hand and the second three right.
You managed to play with though !
Yes its meant as a joke the wtf series
I love liszts transcendental etudes
It’s like Liszt had to show off his 3rd hand that he grew when he was 25
You watched the evolution of Liszt video ay? 😂
My current nightmare. How do you do the fourths in that section?
That was great
It’s alright.
Clash Gy
Some ppl say that aliens make pyramids, but in fact, the only real alien was Frantz Liszt . Pretty sure he got 7 fingers on each hand 😅
Sometimes I playing Mazeppa, There's chaos in the finger number So I played 42 31😂
I see a lot of people negligating this detail and it, kinda frustrates me...
You can see the similar thing at paganini etude 6
how do ur hands look so relaxed while playing
Practice
@@horoffra the one thing i despise about piano is the consistency required
@@aquafine.2250 its the case for all great stuff you can achieve
Liszt: Let's make someone stop play piano! 😅
Fun fact: Some composers wrote with 3 lines of music; i believe i saw it in appassionata? don’t quote me - it could have been a completely different piece
edit: also don’t hate on my saying “yea everyone knows that” cuz i guarantee you that a lot of people just learned this💀
Bravo
I thought maybe you had to play it with the back of the hand 😂
it’s so the thirds have the same articulation and attack
Well you aced it though
First day of simply piano
Looks cool
Seems straightforward. Fingers 2 and 4 on each hand, alternating hands. How else would you play it?
Mazeppa 😅
OHHH YEAAHH
It's just a chromatic slide. It's much more comfortable to do it this way than with conventional fingering. Especially at the tempo Liszt is using.
Ikr people just like to complain about everything for no reason. This fingering is literally easier to learn AND play
the point is not to slide though. Actually the complete opposite.
You’re not sliding as so much playing them like the clapping of horse hooves.
dont slide, that ruins the point of a galloping sound, it should be detached and practically staccato
also sliding doesnt work when youre going from a white key to a black key lol
リストは4‐2の指使いが好きみたいです。ハンガリー狂詩曲第1番の3度の下降も4‐2の 指使いが出てきます。😊
Katsaris does!
Dont think so, sounds like the other fingering
@@horoffra people say it is liszt's, but ok
It could’ve been worse. The middle line could have been a c-clef
It is not WTF, its VERY comfortable fingers for this passage)
You clearly dont know how social media works
Hey giant question when do you know when to use your pedal is there a symbol on the music sheet?
By ear!
Steinway&sons piano!!!! 300000000$
😂😂😂😂 you can do it
that actually works it looks like, never played it tho
Yes it works very well
Song name pls??
mazeppa
I have a question. Is It okay if i do mazeppa before and then preludio?
You are free
@@horoffra thank you man
Easy, always
Liszt himself wanted this fingering, he said that wasn’t worth it playing this piece without the 2/4 2/4 4/2 4/2 2/4 2/4…
Ye, liszt had finges girls can only dream of
I want piano fr fck
Is it possible that his piano at the time would have had lighter keys?
The earliest pianos were quite light indeed. Don't believe me? Try some of C. P. E. Bach's suggested scale fingerings--which were for _piano_ as it existed at the time, as well as harpsichord and clavichord. The general tendency is that what he suggests as a special case fingering for slow and legato is now the standard piano fingering.
Pianos of Liszt where indeed lighter, wich doesnt really solve the problem, I tried, bachs time pianos are not relevant here since thats way before Liszt time
@horoffra I play harpsichord, so my go-to approach to that sort of motion is to slide between the keys. I don't have a Steinway hasn't to try it on, but it works well enough on my electric piano.
@@BethDiane that only works from black to white note, you cannot slide from white to white or white to black wich happens very often too here.
No!!! U just watch yunchan Lim!!!! Pls, just watch and listen !
And then?
You forgot the pedal
Ooooooh my omg 😱
You're gonna get crazy chops if you do all of these
I did already
@@horoffra Well there you go. Utter chad
Ben folds maybe .. lol
Is it confirmed anywhere that Cziffra uses this fingering? I'm skeptical due to the speed he takes it. I find myself believing one can get the non-legato sound with other fingering, and that is much easier to do than getting 24 24 up to speed.
Dont have any confirmation, but no recording sounds as staccato and detached as the one of cziffra wich is the reason of liszt fingering.
@@horoffra thanks. I tried 2424 for months and maybe got 80% of the speed…. So many pianists use the easier fingering. I always wondered if Cziffra used the easier fingering but just made it more staccato than most. To me it seems it would be easier to get the easier fingering staccato than the hard fingering at a fast tempo. If you find a vid of someone doing 24 24 at Cziffra’s tempo, I’d love to see it! It’s one of the hurdles I never mastered
@@ohartnet81 Well the staccato effect can not so easily be brought out with the conventional fingering but Liszt fingering allows it easily
And for a technical giant like Cziffra I don't think its even that hard for him to get Liszt fingering up to speed.... so yes Cziffra did use Liszt's fingering , making him own this piece practically.
@@cziffrathegreat666 I need video proof! lol. Then I can really be put to shame haha
@@ohartnet81 well i dont think that's possible, unless you travel back to the 20th century 😄
Let the ears do the judging
a little faster is enough
Huh. I thought it was Busoni who wrote those fingerings. Interesting.
In my opinion, this fingering is terrible. Just because Liszt wrote it and could do it, it doesn't mean it will work for 90% of pianists
Its an etude
it's not supposed to work for pianists, pianists are supposed to work for it. You've misunderstood the lesson.
Bro made this at 25 too
Лист-это пианизм элитарный! Не для всех( без обид)!
Wow you have steinway
me who doesnt know sh!t about written notes
yes of course
it kinda look like your switching a different hand every closeby fingering lol
運指を変えてはならない😢😢